Honourable Mentions
We are two brothers bumbling our way through the amazing life stories of everyday people who deserve their Honourable Mentions in the annals of history.
It's history. It's educational. It's two blokes mucking about.
Honourable Mentions
The Curious Case of a Cursed Sea Captain
The year is 1872 in Massachusetts, USA.
A handsome, young Master Mariner, named Benjamin Briggs, his wife Sarah, and small daughter Sophia are about to set sail to Genoa, Italy, with a cargo of alcohol. What could possibly go wrong?
Join us and learn about the cursed background of the Briggs family, the cursed background of their ship, and how Benjamin and his crew sailed out from New York and into legend and infamy aboard the Mary Celeste.
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Oh come with me to the rolling sea while the weather's calm and still And we'll have some fun and after with the adventures of Stephen and Neil Hello listener Hello Neil Sub Steve Hello Neil Sub Steve Hello Oh done that Yes Welcome everybody to another episode of Honourable Mentions Honourable Mentions Yes Honourable Mentions You may have realized Honourable mentions Thank you you may have recognised the eagle eared is eagle eared a word eagle eyed is eagle ear eyed bat eared or whatever the very observant listener if our listener is very observant and even you Neil might have realised we had a different little intro.
SPEAKER_04:There you go.
SPEAKER_02:We've had a different intro today because we've got a nautical theme. So I thought we'd go over a little nautical intro, but because we love Pepe and the bandits, we're gonna start with a proper intro from them as well after this little introduction. So we said, hello Neil. We've wished our listener all the best, and we'd like to welcome everybody to Honourable Mentions, please.
SPEAKER_06:Honourable Mentions.
SPEAKER_02:So thank you, everybody. That was Pepe and the Bandits. You'll be hearing more about them at the outro. That's what us professionals call the bit at the end that tells you all about how you can subscribe and how you can email us at honourable mentionspod at gmail.com.
SPEAKER_04:Like or subscribe or tick anything you can about it.
SPEAKER_02:Leave a five-star review, all that sort of lovely stuff. But today, as I have said, we're on a nautical theme. So to start today's episode, hello Neil. I'd like you to close your eyes. That's a lovely dress lovely dress you're wearing today, by the way.
SPEAKER_04:Thank you. I do like to wear it.
SPEAKER_02:I'd like you to uh do some imagining for me if you can.
SPEAKER_04:Oof. I'll have a go. What do you want me? What would you like me to imagine? Anything or just are you gonna start hitting the timing?
SPEAKER_02:I don't need you to imagine anything. God knows where I'll end up with that. No, yes, what we need to do is you you just imagine it's November. And you're in you're in New York standing by the East River.
SPEAKER_04:Right.
SPEAKER_02:Have you got that?
SPEAKER_04:Yeah, I've got it, yeah.
SPEAKER_02:And you're watching men load one and a half thousand large heavy oak casks onto your ship. And what you've got is a dual-masted wooden brig. So there's two masts, and they're rolling all these barrels on there for you, and you've you are an experienced captain. You're thirty-seven years old, you're experienced captain, but this is the first time you've had your own ship, so you're feeling quite proud of yourself.
SPEAKER_04:I've got a good fish-finger business, I suppose, as well, haven't I?
SPEAKER_02:You could have a good fish-finger business going on. You can have that's all your imagination, Neil, that you're doing here. Have you still got your eyes closed? Yeah, yeah. Can you hear the voices and the strains of industry and the creaking of the water?
SPEAKER_04:Like they do in the films.
SPEAKER_02:That's where you are. That's where we're gonna start.
SPEAKER_04:There's a seagull just gone over.
SPEAKER_02:Oh, is it done a plop?
SPEAKER_04:No, no, it just went. Has it tried to eat the chips? No, I didn't have chips, I had an ice cream.
SPEAKER_02:Alright then. So that's where we're starting today. So you can open your eyes again now and stop imagining that, but that's where we are.
SPEAKER_04:You're back in the room.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah. Yep. So this is a profoundly sad and tragic tale about a family. Well, you're gonna have to, I'm afraid. Okay, I'll try my best. This is about a family from Plymouth County, Massachusetts.
SPEAKER_04:A lot of their places over there are named after places in our country, aren't they?
SPEAKER_02:They are, yes.
SPEAKER_04:Why is that, Stephen Cleese?
SPEAKER_02:Well, because we went over there and we laid our foundations, I suppose, didn't we? So Plymouth, for example, is where the Americ Mayflower ship sailed from and took uh Puritans over there, and then they called the first place they landed, Plymouth.
SPEAKER_04:Yeah, well so, because there's there was a Dundee in one of our former podcasts, I do believe. And you also mentioned Barrels, which was made by Coopers, which again I do believe is in one of our other podcasts.
SPEAKER_02:It is, yes, and we also mentioned in another podcast a place called New York, which is like New York. And York is a place in this country, which also mentioned in another podcast.
SPEAKER_04:There is another place called New York which is near Downham Market, and it's actually called New York.
SPEAKER_02:In Norfolk?
SPEAKER_04:Yep.
SPEAKER_02:Well, there you go. Every day's a school day.
SPEAKER_04:You're welcome.
SPEAKER_02:Anyway, this is a profoundly sad tragic tale about a family from Plymouth County in Massachusetts. Not now, lads. These are a family who have salt water coursing through their veins. I don't know how they managed to s how to live, really. Saline solution. Saline solution, isn't it, I suppose. But see Captain Nathan Briggs was him s was himself the son of a naval hero. Johnny Johnny Briggs. It was Johnny Briggs I know that name. Who would be Briggs? Yes. You gonna elaborate?
SPEAKER_04:He was uh wasn't he uh one of the guys in Coronation Street. Yeah, he was one of the actors, I think his name was Johnny Briggs. I also used to be a children's TV programme called Johnny Briggs.
SPEAKER_02:How could you Ken? That's my Coronation Street impression.
SPEAKER_04:That one.
SPEAKER_02:Oh right, sorry, I thought you'd uh I thought you'd open some sort of musical box or something.
SPEAKER_04:No, it's just my talent I have, Stephen.
SPEAKER_02:Oh, that's right, it's it's very good, it isn't abundance. I was telling you about see Captain Nathan Briggs, who himself was the son of a naval hero in the American War of Independence.
SPEAKER_04:Can we call him Johnny?
SPEAKER_02:No, his name's Nathan.
SPEAKER_04:Oh, his dad.
SPEAKER_02:Yes.
SPEAKER_04:Thank you.
SPEAKER_02:Nathan Briggs. Oh, gee, his dad we haven't heard of, so yes, he was that's where you're going to, if that's where your imagination is taking.
SPEAKER_04:I'd like to. Thank you, please.
SPEAKER_02:He married a lady called Sophia Cobb in the year 1830.
SPEAKER_04:So we could have gunned the fish fingerbread rolls in.
SPEAKER_02:Well, between them, they became parents to a family of six boys and two girls, although that their first son, Nathan Stutzen Briggs, would not survive beyond four months. It's already a sad story.
SPEAKER_04:It is, but then if you've got salt salt water going through your veins, it it it's a bit difficult, especially if you're a toddler.
SPEAKER_02:It's already a sad story there as well. And I don't know about the fish finger business because they're too busy banging out children, too busy banging and producing children, whichever way you want to look at that.
SPEAKER_04:Well, that is that yeah.
SPEAKER_02:That's us yeah, the I I think the fish finger business was not an on-goer. The remaining Briggs children grew up in the crowded Rose Cottage, where their seafaring father was often absent for long periods, because he was at sea, I should imagine.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:But Sophia thought so Sophia, their mother, made sure that each enjoyed a good education and played close adherence to the teachings of the Bibla. So the word of Jesus and all sorry, Bible, so the word of Jesus and all that sort of stuff.
SPEAKER_04:The baby Jesus.
SPEAKER_02:The baby Jesus. The Christian religion was important and closely observed by all the family. So they were all out. But then again, you're talking eighteen thirties, USA, Massachusetts. Not now, boys. And most people would have been religious around that time, I think, deeply religious as well. In fact, I think if you go to America nowadays, a lot of the population are still deeply religious in the Christian faith. Yes, I'm sure they are.
SPEAKER_04:That's very true.
SPEAKER_02:It's not a criticism, it's not a uh it's not a yes, it's not anything, it's just a statement there. So please don't feel that you need to email in to honorable mentionspod.gmail.com. Where's Stephen? Sorry? HonorableMentionsPard at gmail.com, or you could even contact us on social media, but we don't really need to hear from people saying that we've dismissed the Christian faith. I don't think we have. I think we've been rather true. Of of the five Briggs boys, how many of them would also follow in their father's splash steps and take to the ocean waves?
SPEAKER_04:Ooh, and so there was five of them.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_04:I'm gonna go with one.
SPEAKER_02:No, four.
SPEAKER_04:Oh damn.
SPEAKER_02:Only one didn't. Don't know who. But there was Benjamin Briggs, Benny Briggs, and his younger brother Oliver.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:Ollie Briggs. They were such naturals that they both became master mariners, able to command their own vessels before they'd even turn the age of thirty. So that's actually quite a cheap.
SPEAKER_04:Well, it's not achievement, really, is it? When they leave school.
SPEAKER_02:If they ever went to school, because it says their mother educated boats all their life. I don't know. But yeah, even so, you had to go you didn't just get given captaincy of a boat, you had to show proficiency, you had to move through the ranks, you had to be awarded it. Because don't forget, when you were imagining at the very start, you were imagining your very own boat for the first time. So often these captains were appointed by the owners of the boat who were companies or individual wealthy people, so they'd had to trust you with the captaincy of their boat. So it was a serious job.
SPEAKER_04:Sorry, Steve. Sorry. Did you? Yeah, sorry. So you're back in the room. I'm back now, yeah. I'm back engaged into it again now.
SPEAKER_02:What what happened there?
SPEAKER_04:Sorry, don't worry about it.
SPEAKER_02:By 1860, Oliver, who was the younger brother, if you remember, of these two of these pairs.
SPEAKER_04:I do remember him, yes.
SPEAKER_02:Oliver had taken a wife, and two years later, his elder brother Benjamin did the same. Although she completely oh she was a completely different woman, obviously. Yes, yes, he took his own wife, then he he he got married also. That'd be big. That'd be weird, wouldn't it? Look, the lady he married was called Sarah Cobb, daughter of if you think back to his parents.
SPEAKER_04:Yes, I mean that's her name was Cobb as well, wasn't it?
SPEAKER_02:Her name was Cobb. So this Sarah Cobb was daughter of Reverend Leander Cobb, who happened to be the brother of his mother Sophia, which makes her his first cousin. So yes, so Leander Cobb was Benjamin's father-in-law and uncle all at the same time.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah. Dirty pick.
SPEAKER_02:Although the family and Benjamin, of course, saw her as a devoutly good Christian woman for a devoutly religious husband. So there was that side of it. The couple honeymooned aboard the schooner Forest King, which was under Benjamin's captaincy as she sailed a round trip to Marseille in France.
SPEAKER_04:Oh, bonjour.
SPEAKER_02:Bonjour. Yeah. Um au revoir.
SPEAKER_04:Yeah, definitely.
SPEAKER_02:Le Lesange et dans l'Abre.
unknown:Oh.
SPEAKER_02:Petit Pois. Yes. Um Petit Filou. We can do all sorts, we're very natural.
SPEAKER_04:La Fenette et dans Mon Velo.
SPEAKER_02:I'm I'm a natural. I'm a I'm fluent, very fluent.
SPEAKER_04:Yeah. I just said my windows in my the windows in my bike.
SPEAKER_02:Thierry Henry. Lesange dans l'Abra, the monkeys in the monkeys in the tree.
SPEAKER_04:I know that one.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah.
SPEAKER_04:Oh yes.
SPEAKER_02:La piscine. A chili. Swimming pool is called. That's a bit of a who'd want to call a swimming pool the piscine. I mean it's a bit too honest. It's a bit too honest, isn't it?
SPEAKER_04:It's a bit close to the micro, isn't it? 'Cause let's face it, I don't think there's anyone on the planet that hasn't actually had a wee in the pool.
SPEAKER_02:You've done a wee in a pool? Not everybody.
SPEAKER_04:Well, it's like well did, but I suppose I should have done it under the water.
SPEAKER_02:I was gonna say, from the diving pool.
SPEAKER_04:Yeah, that was a bit that's I just I did get in trouble for that, but never mind, eh? Butlins butlins will let me back in now.
SPEAKER_02:I'll tell you what, if we do actually have a listener, perhaps they'd like to email us or contact us on social media and tell us about their pool urination stories. Maybe has anybody out there actually gone for a bit of a whoopsey in a swimming pool and it's changed the colour of the pool because they put that stuff in there, don't they, now, sometimes? Is that true? I don't know, but how embarrassing would that be?
SPEAKER_04:You'd just you stand next to a small child when you do it, surely.
SPEAKER_02:Anyway, back to their honeymoon as they're sailing this round trip to Marseille in La Francais, um, with Thierry Henri and Zinazinda Dan and all those people. It seemed it seemed to go well. Sarah was soon mucking. Gerardo? Oh yeah, Gerard Deput De Pardieu and uh Marie Antoinette, those sort of people. Sarah was soon mucking in the crow, often talked of taking her up the Lubber's hole and how she'd helped them finish the job with a good hard tug when they had their fingers in the snatch block. Hard? They were heady days indeed. That's they're they're all you're fine now, they're all perfectly legitimate nautical terms. Ready? So I don't know where your imagination was taking you there. Yes, the lubber's hole. The lubber's hole, it's perfectly possible to get your fingers. It's perfectly possible to get your fingers stuck in the snatch block and you'll need a good old tug to get them out again. That's what that's saying.
SPEAKER_04:I should imagine, I should imagine Mr. Briggs got a bit of a chub on.
SPEAKER_02:Is that a nautical term?
SPEAKER_04:That's another that's another nautical term, yeah.
SPEAKER_02:Or you just being filthy.
SPEAKER_04:No, no, no. So Mrs. Cobb, she was in France. Did she change her name to Mrs. Coitant?
SPEAKER_02:Ah No, because she wasn't Mrs. Cobb, was she? She married Benjamin. Yeah, come on. She was Benjamin, Mrs.
SPEAKER_04:Bruce. Think about it.
SPEAKER_02:So you so it doesn't make any sense what you've just said. Floweryb That's not anything to do with France or to do with nauticals. This is a very serious story, Neil, please. Right. Over time, Benjamin left the Forest King behind. That means he he stopped being captain, didn't mean he swam for it. He just took the you know, stopped it. And Oliver, his younger brother, took the captaincy because apparently there are only two sea captains in all of America, these two had it covered, didn't they? Yeah, you know, you Briggs boys. Benjamin moved on to command a three-masted tall ship called Arthur.
SPEAKER_03:Or why Arthur called Arthur?
SPEAKER_02:Yeah. Oh Arthur. Oh why Arthur? VAT. Yes it, yeah. Excuse me. While he was captain of this vessel, Benjamin and Sarah welcomed their firstborn baby boy. And for today's countdown conundrum, Neil, I'd like you to tell me what the name of that boy was, please go.
SPEAKER_04:Let's go with something nautical.
SPEAKER_02:Um his crab, no, crab briggs. No. Okay. He moved on to command a three-masted tall ship named Arthur. Arthur. It was while he was the captain of this vessel called Arthur that Benjamin and Sarah welcomed their first born baby boy. So we'll try again. Any guesses what this boy was called, please, Neil.
SPEAKER_04:Andy?
SPEAKER_02:Oh no, it was Barry.
SPEAKER_04:It was a good guy.
SPEAKER_02:No, it was it was Arthur.
SPEAKER_04:Was it?
SPEAKER_02:I tried to give it later.
SPEAKER_04:That's not much of imagination there, was it?
SPEAKER_02:No, but uh the if the I was trying to give you all the clues. But you you weren't going through it. Yes, they called him Arthur. I don't know where they got the name from, but Sand. It's a good job. It's a good job it wasn't captaining Boaty McBoatface or whatever it's called, isn't it? That could have been an embarrassing name. Despite the wedding bells and christening cups, the cold hand of misfortune had never left the shoulder of the Briggs family from Marion, Massachusetts.
SPEAKER_04:Not now, lads. Not now, lads. Leave that there.
SPEAKER_02:Leave it there. Leave it there for a bit, please. Thank you. By the date of Arthur's birth, three of Benjamin and Oliver's siblings had already met their end. And when Sarah gave birth to Sophia Matilda Briggs in 1870, that number had increased to four of the Briggs siblings. And in fact, one night, grand old Captain Nathan Briggs had finished his supper and wandered outside onto the doorstep of Rose Cottage to light his pipe and break a little wind, as he was right to do, because it's his house. He decided he went to watch a brewing storm sway the landscape of eastern white pines when he was struck down by lightning and killed dead.
SPEAKER_03:Wow.
SPEAKER_02:That's a true story. That's a true story. I mean, what a what a sad, sad little life for that family.
SPEAKER_04:Is it a true story that he farted though?
SPEAKER_02:Um I did that bit in for a bit of uh you know a bit of ad lib, like yeah, a bit of ad lib so you could picture the scene in your imagination that you've been using today.
SPEAKER_04:I suppose he did because he was probably sat by the table thinking, cross I need to go I need to I need to tear a strip off of you.
SPEAKER_02:Well that's what would you do is you went outside, there's a storm brewing, you're watching the the white pine swaying in the distance. Exactly. You've just had your tea, you're sort of Victorian. You're Victorian, you don't want to you don't want to uh embarrass yourself in front of your wife. So you go outside, light your pipe, and break if you're off. That's what you do, isn't it?
SPEAKER_04:Yeah, just blame on everything else as you're walking. That's just a sign of confidence if you can do it in mid-walk. I think as as you get older, you can't really do it so much.
SPEAKER_02:Perhaps he was such a sailor, such a uh one with nature that he could time his fat with the thunderclaps. So no captain. Yeah. But I didn't see the bolt of lightning come in and uh it hit him, and that was the end of poor old Nathan. So that's Nathan and four of his kids all gone before their time.
SPEAKER_04:That's that is sad. And then that could but then again you said before their time that could have been their time.
SPEAKER_02:That probably was. That's that's a very philosophical way of looking at that, Neil.
SPEAKER_04:You're welcome.
SPEAKER_02:Well done, Neil! So Nathan and four of his kids, and then Benjamin and Sarah had two more children, little brothers of Arthur and Sophie, one little boy and one little girl, and neither of them survived beyond five months. I told you this was a sad story today, and you were making light of it by assuming that my nautical references were some sort of smut. You should feel ashamed. Perhaps when you consider the impact all that would have had, it's not a surprise that the brothers came to a decision.
SPEAKER_04:That's not having babies.
SPEAKER_02:They did stop having babies, but I don't know whether that was a decision. They decided No, because that would be the same thing as you've just said.
SPEAKER_04:Okay, just try to um get back into it.
SPEAKER_02:They decided they need to be around the home a bit more, so they both decided to leave the ocean behind and set up a hardware store closer to home instead.
SPEAKER_04:That makes sense.
SPEAKER_02:If if you've got two of them, you've got Benjamin and Oliver, it could have been called it could have been called B and O. But then B O wouldn't work, would it?
SPEAKER_04:So they called the Briggs Brothers.
SPEAKER_02:Briggs Brothers, Briggs Brothers Hardware.
SPEAKER_04:Yeah. Briggs and Briggs.
SPEAKER_02:They wouldn't have called it Texas. That was a hardware store here in the 80s, children. For those of you who don't remember.
SPEAKER_04:They could have called it do-it-all.
SPEAKER_02:How do do it all do it?
SPEAKER_04:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:Won't somebody tell? If only we knew it and do it all do it, you'd be sure. You'd be doing it as well. Uh there you go. More nineties adverts are available. We should we should do those things, you know. We can get like birthday carts and you get pe people to do greetings online. We should get people to email us through social media or on Can you not remember?
SPEAKER_04:Yeah, you should say it.
SPEAKER_02:On honorable mentionspod at gmail.com and you could you could ask us to perform a obscure 1970s, 80s, 90s TV ad.
SPEAKER_04:Honourable Mentionspod at gmail.com.
SPEAKER_02:Oh done. Yeah, who you just get in where else you just got in there.
SPEAKER_04:Honourable Mentionspod at gmail.com. I'm kind of added a bit more sort of artistic. It's very good to work at. Honourable Mentions pod at gmail.com. How's that?
SPEAKER_02:These are all very, very good. Shakespearean actor, was it?
SPEAKER_04:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:Do it in a um do it in a pirate kind of voice to fit in with our nautical theme.
SPEAKER_04:Honourable mentions pod at gmail.com.
SPEAKER_02:No, I said do it in a pirate never mind. I don't know what that was.
SPEAKER_04:That was a pirate, thank you very much. I think you're fine. That was very close to Captain Slack, what his name was on um Caribbean Pirate Singy.
SPEAKER_02:Captain Slack on Caribbean Pirates Thingy. Yes, one of my favourite, yes.
SPEAKER_04:Yeah. Yeah. I don't think it was. Well they say in it. Well they say R. They don't really, do they?
SPEAKER_02:There is a story behind that, do you don't you know? There was a uh Hollywood film in the I want to say 1950s that was about Treasure Eyes. What I said.
SPEAKER_04:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:This film was. It was Technicolor, you know, that era of Technicolor when they're really bright and all the women would be historical, but they all have perfect makeup and lipstick and all that sort of stuff. Is that Technicolor? I don't know, Neil. But anyway, you keep your little imagination there. But yes, they did this Treasure Island, Long John Silver and all that, and they got this American actor in, and he Inferno. Pardon.
SPEAKER_03:What Inferno? Charlton Heston.
SPEAKER_02:Ben Hur, Planet of the Apes.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:Get your hands off me, you damn dirty ape. All that sort of stuff. Anyway, we're talking about this film. Um, and this guy decided that his Long John Silver was come from Western England, so he did uh what an appropriation of what he thought West the Western England person sounded like. So that's why we have the Araby Arties and all that sort of stuff.
SPEAKER_04:I thought you were talking about his ring named his phallus when he got his Long John Silver. Sorry.
SPEAKER_02:For the listener at home, the name of the actor was Robert Newton in the 1950 Disney production of Treasure Island. As Robert Newton in Treasure Island. And now back to the fan. So there they were, right? These two brothers. Do you think it's a good idea? Greggs and Briggs. Do you think it's a good idea that they surrounded themselves with pickaxes and blades and saws and hammers?
SPEAKER_04:I can't see why not, because they spent most of the time at sea, so I don't think they'd probably know how to use them.
SPEAKER_02:They they probably did know how to use them, but also their family does seem a bit keen on truffling itself off the mortal coil, doesn't it? But dash it all anyway, because at the end the lure of adventure and sold air proved too much for these hearty seafaring Briggs brothers. So guess what they did? They went back to the wet, didn't they? They went back out there to the ocean. Oliver was first, so he pulled all his money that he was going to invest in this hardware store, and instead put it into the good ship Julia A. Halleck. Had of a name for a ship that.
SPEAKER_04:Julia Haddock. Julia. Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:A for Alpha. And then Halleck. H A L for Lima. L for Lima. Oscar Charlie Kelo. There you go. I know that. So Halleck, Junior A Halleck. That's a good job, really, I suppose. Benjamin didn't come across that ship before, and that's what you've been on.
SPEAKER_04:I bring these out every time. Sorry.
SPEAKER_02:Sorry, you're doing that joke again.
SPEAKER_04:Yeah. Oh, you're welcome. Everyone's gonna be using it eventually. If as soon as someone says, Oh, you couldn't wish to come across a nicer bloke, it'll happen. Watch this space.
SPEAKER_02:Okay, we'll watch that one. We'll watch that one like a hawk, but I was more getting at the fact that if if our friend Benjamin had been captaining in that ship when his son was born, instead of Arthur, his son could have been called Julia A. Halleck Briggs. So that was quite a very close thing for a young Arthur, I'd have said.
SPEAKER_04:Yeah, that was very close.
SPEAKER_02:Benjamin bought into a consortium to purchase a brigantine, which if you remember from the very start, is a two-mastive ship ship. The Brig Benjamin bought into had begun life as Amazon in 1861 and was only a little over ten years old. But like the tragic Briggs family, she too has been through troubled times. So when she was initially launched, the crew were out, so she was left with a neighbour. No, that's an Amazon joke.
SPEAKER_04:I see what he did there. Yes. Yeah, mother laughing because you didn't have mine.
SPEAKER_02:No, though that's the sort of joke that's going to catch on there. Everyone's going to be telling that joke in a few days' time. That'll be spreading that wildfire.
SPEAKER_04:It's quite well, it's not. It's like when you go and see a comedian and people say, How was it? Oh, I don't know, I can't remember. What do you say? Oh dear, I can't remember.
SPEAKER_02:You remember this one because Michael McIntyre will be claiming it's his joke, but you heard it here first, chaps.
SPEAKER_04:An Amazon seafaring joke. We just say people, it's a it's it's this podcast is for everybody.
SPEAKER_02:Well, I meant chaps. I meant chaps in an all-encompassing term rather than in any sort of gender-specific chap. But anyway, I do take your point, thank you.
SPEAKER_03:You're welcome.
SPEAKER_02:So the Amazon, her first captain, he died on her maiden voyage.
SPEAKER_04:All this salty water is not good for anybody, is it?
SPEAKER_02:Just died of natural causes on her maiden voyage. Her second captain got entangled with fishing equipment off Eastport in Maine. So he got the ship all tangled up, and then when he was out over this way in the English Channel, he collided with and consequently sank a fellow brig. And it was his fault apparently, so yeah, that ship seemed to be as cursed as the Brig's family, didn't it? It wasn't doing very well. Finally, in October eighteen sixty seven, at a place called Cape Breton, Amazon was driven ashore in a terrible storm and was so badly damaged on the rocks that her owners decided to abandon her as a wreck once and for all, casually whistling with their hands in their pockets as they sauntered away. That sort of that's what I'm picturing. So I'll just leave that there, lads. Pretend we hadn't seen that just run.
SPEAKER_04:Just just that is.
SPEAKER_02:Oh that wreck, I haven't seen that there.
SPEAKER_04:Filthy pig.
SPEAKER_02:I hadn't seen that at all, though you're saying. But But Amazon was rescued.
SPEAKER_04:By um what's his name?
SPEAKER_02:Tim Bezos.
SPEAKER_04:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:No. Don't know why you're making that sort of leak. The Amazon River? I don't know. What came first? The Amazon online retailer or the uh millennial old Amazon River? Difficult. Hmm. She anyway, she was rescued. We've already hussard that. But then she was restored. Double hussar.
SPEAKER_04:Oh, that's nice. That's lovely.
SPEAKER_02:And then she was resold and refitted. Huzzah!
SPEAKER_04:So it's like a find it, fix it, sell it thing. Yes. That's where this program started from.
SPEAKER_02:Was that a programme on the telly that one watches?
SPEAKER_04:I think it's called Find It Fix It' Find It Fix It Flog It or something like that, isn't it? I believe.
SPEAKER_02:No, they have a shed and they people take these things.
SPEAKER_04:Oh, is that East Enders?
SPEAKER_02:The shed that's broken and then they get them repaired.
SPEAKER_04:Yeah, it's East Enders, Steve.
SPEAKER_02:Is it?
SPEAKER_04:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:Alright, okay. Um so there she was. She was resold and refitted. Then she was resold again, recovered as debt, resold another time, refurbished, resized, and eventually renamed. And now we come to the point where you, earlier, as a young handsome captain, was standing on the dock watching labourers load barrels. You remember that bit?
SPEAKER_04:Yeah, I do, yes. I was back there just straight yeah, literally flashback straight back to it. Thank you.
SPEAKER_02:Yes, whenever I click my fingers from now on, you'll be taken you'll be taken straight back there.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:So what you were there, what you were looking on through there, you see, was Benjamin Briggs' eyes. You were seeing it from his point of view. So that young captain was Benjamin Briggs. And that ship that he was looking at was on its way to Italy. In fact, it was it was on its way to Genoa with his hand-picked crew. So he was a he was experienced, he picked his own experienced crew, and now they were sailing with these barrels that were full of faster. No, they weren't, they were full of um alcohol, but not drinking alcohol. I've just told you, they're full of alcohol, but not drinking alcohol. No, not drinking alcohol, just scientific type alcohol. Now just pure alcohol. So that's what I'm saying.
SPEAKER_04:Rubbing alcohol, if you will.
SPEAKER_02:You may rub it. Perhaps if for medical purposes.
SPEAKER_04:Yes, it's very good for cleaning electricals as well. Do you know that?
SPEAKER_02:No.
SPEAKER_04:Yeah. Components and motherboards, etc.
SPEAKER_02:Anyway, carry on. Sorry, I just slipped into a coma. Back again. So he was standing he was standing there, he was watching, and what he was dreaming of at that point in time was his wife Sarah's reaction on first seeing the newly fitted out captain's quarters. Because not only had he had he managed to get hold of the ship himself, but he'd now redesigned it as well, in a special captain's quarters specifically designed to accommodate him and his wife and their two-year-old daughter, Sophia.
SPEAKER_04:Yeah, they won't look after her, wouldn't they?
SPEAKER_02:Yeah. And also, of course, to keep the crew out, because he didn't want them bothering his wife.
SPEAKER_04:Well exactly, yeah, if you're a long time at sea, and if you're a red-blooded man, let's assume that all the crew were men, please. Um, yeah, it could be a long time especially a lady walking round, you'd be like, hmm.
SPEAKER_02:Well when they got back Yes, when they got back off Honeymoon the first time, he asked Sarah whether she enjoyed it, and she said yes, but then she indicated her forehead and said that she'd had a fill of semen right up to her. So I don't think she she'd had enough of of the seafarers.
SPEAKER_04:Yes, I certainly was full of it.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah. But she was an extraordinary trooper, despite all of that.
SPEAKER_04:She sounded, to be honest, Stephen. She does sound it, thank you. She does sound an extraordinary trooper.
SPEAKER_02:She was, because when he first proposed the idea of coming to sea with him again, she squealed with delight, all too willing to travel.
SPEAKER_04:She thought, well, there we go again. Time for a top-up.
SPEAKER_02:But what was sad, the sad part here, is as they prepared, folding their clothes and sheets and blankets into wooden trunks and all that, you can imagine that, can't you? So as they're preparing to set sail, unfortunately, they were leaving behind their son Arthur. You've got to stay on VAT on the sleep piece, Dave, and that sort of stuff. Because Arthur, of course, by this time was about five years old. So he was in the early days of his schooling. He was those days, probably working at Pachumni or something like that. But he went to live with his grandmother until his family returned.
SPEAKER_04:Nice. But did they return Stephen?
SPEAKER_02:Well, well, Benjamin thought, you know, the poor soul is we're leaving him behind, we're going off on the adventure of a lifetime, and he's gonna wish he'd come with us, and I wish I could have taken him. But what I have not told you is that when they renamed the Amazon and it fell into the hands of Benjamin Briggs, do you know what they renamed it to? Arthur to the Mary Celeste. Ooh, I've heard of that. So this ship that Benjamin, Sarah, and little Sophia went out on with their crew was the Mary Celeste. Ah, I've heard of this. So what do you know about the Mary Celeste then, please, Neil?
SPEAKER_04:I know that I've heard of it, and I know that people call it the Mary Celeste, and I know it's a ship.
SPEAKER_02:Oh, okay. Well it's the Mary Celeste, and it was found abandoned, floating out at sea.
SPEAKER_03:Ooh.
SPEAKER_02:With nobody on board at all. And in fact, it looked like there'd been no struggle. It looked like they were in the middle of dinner or whatever, but everyone had disappeared. There was not a soul. Not a soul on board.
SPEAKER_04:And in fact, they never found it there'd be other fish as well, though, but even they wouldn't be on board.
SPEAKER_02:When I say not a soul on board, I mean like uh Smokey Robinson and Aretha Franklin, those sort of singers.
SPEAKER_04:Oh, sorry, not the soul fish.
SPEAKER_02:No, soul singers.
SPEAKER_04:Oh, soul the fish.
SPEAKER_02:They never found the crew, never found Benjamin and Sophia Briggs, never f never found the the poor little girl. It was just left there. And modern theory has it that one of the barrels of alcohol may have leaked and the alcohol fumes or whatever got into people, and then it may have exploded and caused them to think, oh no, we're sinking. So they left the ship. Or another theory is that they actually went into a lifeboat and tied themselves behind the ship, thinking, we'll you know go off for a minute, see what else happens if another barrel explodes or whatever, and then we'll get back on board and the rope between them and the ship severed. But whatever happened, yeah, it's one of the greatest mysteries of of maritime history. A mystery of history of Mary Celeste.
SPEAKER_04:Well, they could have come back and done what that bloke did in that canoe. It could have been that sort of scenario, couldn't it?
SPEAKER_02:But pretend they were dead.
SPEAKER_04:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, but he had life insurance.
SPEAKER_04:They're probably still alive.
SPEAKER_02:But these people from the 18th, 19th century.
SPEAKER_04:Yeah, they could be living at the bottom of the sea.
SPEAKER_02:Living at the bottom. Go on, you can have to you can't just say that, you're gonna have to elaborate now. You know, SpongeBob SquarePants, you know that wasn't a documentary, don't you? That was actually a a cartoon.
SPEAKER_04:You've got them princesses and like the little mermaid and things, they're all down there.
unknown:Okay.
SPEAKER_04:And that's what I'm saying.
SPEAKER_02:What we'll do what what we'll do next summer, I'll take you to Chroma on the side of a boat and kick you over the side and tie a shoelace round your toe, and then you can go down there and have a look. And then I'll I'll pull you back up.
SPEAKER_04:Yeah, okay. I've done some crabbing down there, Steve, so I know the sea quite well.
SPEAKER_02:Yes, you're quite an expert. The year after the discovery of an abandoned Mary Celeste, the Julia B. Halleck, if you remember, was Oliver's ship.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:Was wrecked in a storm. And a cap a captain who remember was Oliver, we've already said this. Yeah, he survived for four days on the wreckage, but then died just two hours before help arrived.
SPEAKER_04:Oh, joking. I bet he was saying, Come on. Yeah, hurry up. And they've got to go as quick as they can, but they're literally going about two miles an hour.
SPEAKER_02:Come on, I can see you over there. Get here quick. Sorry, can't go any faster. We've got a lunch break, unions, and all that. Yeah, we've got here.
SPEAKER_04:Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:Just gonna have to anchor here for another half hour.
SPEAKER_04:Just have to hang on for a bit.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, waiting for my boss to turn up. We can't wait for a skip. We can't.
SPEAKER_04:Like the old but Bill Harvey used to be the physio at Peter United, wasn't it? That sort of thing. You know, you're laying on the floor injured and then he needs to come on with his bag, and it'd take about 15 minutes to run to that playline. Yeah, he's been a little minute. Little bit. Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:So out of the out of this family, Arthur Stanley Briggs.
SPEAKER_04:We've got no one in there.
SPEAKER_02:Arthur, that was her son.
SPEAKER_04:Oh no, you said at this family, I thought you were talking about our family.
SPEAKER_02:No, no, this what I no, the Briggs family who have been talking about though, did you? Out of the Briggs family. Rivers. Out of the Briggs family.
SPEAKER_04:Okay, the Briggs family, yeah.
SPEAKER_02:Arthur died in 1931 at the age of 66. But he never, never took to a life at sea. Is there any surprise?
SPEAKER_04:He wanted to get rid of his salty vein.
SPEAKER_02:I don't, you probably want Yes. Oh, you are you're such fella smut. It's unbelievable. I'm trying it's me trying to be sensible, and you're just uh so fella smut. Anyway, so today, dear listener, our story was about Benjamin Briggs, the captain of the infamous Mary Celeste. I'd suggest that perhaps you uh took to reading up about the Mary Celeste after our podcast, which was what we've just had, and you can tune in again.
SPEAKER_04:Because he just literally lost everything. Including himself his own life. Including his own life. Yeah, yeah, yeah. If he did that, that's a bit silly, isn't it? You'd just send like on the ship, you think, ooh, what is all this? You'd you'd send one of the inferior lads, wouldn't you? Just go and check that out and see what's going on over there, pal, will you? Shut the door the way out so we don't get anything.
SPEAKER_02:That's probably what they did. And then he came back and said, one of the barrels has exploded. And they all thought, oh, as you would say, crivons. We better we can't hang about here in case any more of them explode. What then we're gonna try we're gonna sink. Yeah, but why jump off the boat?
SPEAKER_04:Why not chuck the boats the barrels off?
SPEAKER_02:Because these are hefty weighted barrels full of alcohol. Well, cut hold on the bottom of the ship and tip them out. Oh, that would have worked. Why did anyone think of that, I wonder? Sacky. Yes. Is this your application for a life on the on the ocean waves?
SPEAKER_03:Yep.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, well done. So thank you, dear listener. If anyone is listening here and wants to employ Neil as a maritime captain, that was his CV. We look forward to seeing you again next time on Honourable Mentions. And I would like to say the lights really did go down in Massachusetts. Take it away, boys.
SPEAKER_00:Hello. I'm a little character you've just imagined. No one else can see or hear me. It's just that it's all alone here in a vast emptiness of your mind.